Comments on: Frame Saw: Push or Pull? http://www.galoototron.com/2009/12/15/frame-saw-push-or-pull/ Woodworking with Hand Tools Wed, 14 Jul 2010 22:24:10 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Brian http://www.galoototron.com/2009/12/15/frame-saw-push-or-pull/comment-page-1/#comment-337 Brian Wed, 16 Dec 2009 20:54:57 +0000 http://www.galoototron.com/?p=546#comment-337 So I did a little more sawing this morning, this time with some yellow-poplar/tuliptree/lireodendron tulipifera/whatever you want to call it. The grain orientation is definitely a factor here, not just whether you push or pull. When going against the grain, you get a sort of choppy feeling that eases up as you near a 90-degree angle. When going with the grain, the sawing action is much smoother, but it definitely doesn't cut as smoothly. Jeremy, the ECE saw you mention reminds me of the rake angle. That sort of saw would definitely cut in both directions, but given that it's not a very aggressive angle, how quickly and at which orientation? And sharpening would probably need to be done with a feather-edge file. All of this said, one can theorize about this stuff all day long, but actually trying it out would probably be more useful. The blade I'm using now does not have a terribly aggressive rake angle. I would like to resharpen it at some point with a zero-degree rake angle and see how much of a difference it makes. I still have a lot more sawing to try out. Unfortunately, I'm not going to have much time for anything in the next three weeks. So I did a little more sawing this morning, this time with some yellow-poplar/tuliptree/lireodendron tulipifera/whatever you want to call it. The grain orientation is definitely a factor here, not just whether you push or pull. When going against the grain, you get a sort of choppy feeling that eases up as you near a 90-degree angle. When going with the grain, the sawing action is much smoother, but it definitely doesn’t cut as smoothly.

Jeremy, the ECE saw you mention reminds me of the rake angle. That sort of saw would definitely cut in both directions, but given that it’s not a very aggressive angle, how quickly and at which orientation? And sharpening would probably need to be done with a feather-edge file. All of this said, one can theorize about this stuff all day long, but actually trying it out would probably be more useful.

The blade I’m using now does not have a terribly aggressive rake angle. I would like to resharpen it at some point with a zero-degree rake angle and see how much of a difference it makes.

I still have a lot more sawing to try out. Unfortunately, I’m not going to have much time for anything in the next three weeks.

]]> By: Luke Townsley http://www.galoototron.com/2009/12/15/frame-saw-push-or-pull/comment-page-1/#comment-336 Luke Townsley Wed, 16 Dec 2009 16:16:43 +0000 http://www.galoototron.com/?p=546#comment-336 I don't know why, but frame saws for resawing intrigue me. Perhaps my New Year's resolution should be to build one this year. It seems like a fun niche that has been understudied and relatively little understood. Besides that, I really do need one since I don't have a bandsaw. I don’t know why, but frame saws for resawing intrigue me. Perhaps my New Year’s resolution should be to build one this year.

It seems like a fun niche that has been understudied and relatively little understood.

Besides that, I really do need one since I don’t have a bandsaw.

]]> By: Bob Easton http://www.galoototron.com/2009/12/15/frame-saw-push-or-pull/comment-page-1/#comment-335 Bob Easton Wed, 16 Dec 2009 12:09:16 +0000 http://www.galoototron.com/?p=546#comment-335 I think a lot of it depends on how you hold the work Brian, and what muscles are used from that direction. The "wedged below" benches that Jeremy mentions can be seen here: http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/?p=475 I pushed with that arrangement and really built up my anterior deltoids. :) I'll try pulling the next time I need to do that kind of work; it might make better use of the stronger back muscles. THANKS Jeremy for mentioning the ECE saws. I had not seen them before, and the "Farmer's" blade looks interesting for bidirectional use. The last bidirectional blade I tried had much different geometry and was agonizingly slow. This one might be a lot better. More about them here: http://www.adriatools.com/ece/saws/bowsaw.html#E251 Good luck with the beech Brian. I think a lot of it depends on how you hold the work Brian, and what muscles are used from that direction.

The “wedged below” benches that Jeremy mentions can be seen here:
http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/?p=475

I pushed with that arrangement and really built up my anterior deltoids. :) I’ll try pulling the next time I need to do that kind of work; it might make better use of the stronger back muscles.

THANKS Jeremy for mentioning the ECE saws. I had not seen them before, and the “Farmer’s” blade looks interesting for bidirectional use. The last bidirectional blade I tried had much different geometry and was agonizingly slow. This one might be a lot better.
More about them here:
http://www.adriatools.com/ece/saws/bowsaw.html#E251

Good luck with the beech Brian.

]]> By: Jeremy Kriewaldt http://www.galoototron.com/2009/12/15/frame-saw-push-or-pull/comment-page-1/#comment-334 Jeremy Kriewaldt Wed, 16 Dec 2009 04:12:07 +0000 http://www.galoototron.com/?p=546#comment-334 When I am sitting on a sawbench and have the wood wedged below like Bob Easton, I orient the saw to cut on the pull - the action is like rowing, so the cut should be the same as the stroke for a rower! When I put the timber in the vice oriented vertically I tend to cut on the push stroke. You can sidestep the issue if you use an ECE blade which allows cutting in each direction. When I am sitting on a sawbench and have the wood wedged below like Bob Easton, I orient the saw to cut on the pull – the action is like rowing, so the cut should be the same as the stroke for a rower! When I put the timber in the vice oriented vertically I tend to cut on the push stroke.

You can sidestep the issue if you use an ECE blade which allows cutting in each direction.

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